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Seòmar agus comataidhean

Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Current session: 13 May 2021 to 30 November 2025
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Displaying 1438 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

Good morning, everyone. In our previous session, I was very interested—and I still am—in image-based abuse across the board. I have done a bit of work since that conversation, and I am now convinced that there is a gap in the law in relation to abusive sex-based images, and particularly in relation to consent. I am talking about the sharing of those images and the damage and harm that can be done to children and young people in particular. That is the context.

Alison Penman mentioned that issue specifically. I want to ask her about young people—or however we want to categorise older children.

I noted everything in your submissions about the importance of how you message young people. You would not do that in the same way that you would to adults. I am conscious that most of the work focuses on the risk that is presented by adults. However, we are talking about children. Do you think that there is a gap in the law in relation to the harm that can be done if images are shared? I know that Stuart Allardyce has mentioned that fake images are a live issue. I am not convinced that the law is adequate at the moment. What do you think about that?

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

Of course, we do not have control over the tech companies that we would like. There is controversy currently around how far the Online Safety Bill goes.

I noted what you said about how to deal with young people and how trauma can be the basis on which people’s behaviour is maybe what it should not be, but there is normalising in schools that is acceptable. Will you come back on that? That is the area in which I think there might need to be stronger messages in the law in relation to the sharing of images because, once images are shared, it is very difficult to get them back.

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

I know that Stuart Allardyce might want to answer that question, but I will ask Detective Superintendent Martin MacLean what powers Police Scotland has to delete images. I am not even sure that that is in your jurisdiction. The issue is that there is a grey area around whether what we are talking about is actually contrary to the law, but are there any powers on the deletion of images?

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

They consented to the image, but they did not consent to the sharing. It is the sharing aspect of it that constitutes the offence.

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

Is it unlawful to share such an image with so many others?

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

Yes, that is helpful. I do not have any further questions, but other panel members, such as Stuart Allardyce, might want to answer the same question.

Criminal Justice Committee

Tackling Online Child Abuse, Grooming and Exploitation

Meeting date: 31 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

It is. Thank you.

Criminal Justice Committee

Economic Crime and Corporate Transparency Bill

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

I am fully supportive of that notion. My concern is about one micro-element: why would we not want the Scottish Parliament to set the fees? Why would you want the profession to set them? That is the bit that I do not understand. Is that where there is to be parity with England? I get the bit about unlimited fines, which makes absolute sense here.

Criminal Justice Committee

Economic Crime and Corporate Transparency Bill

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

I apologise—I meant fines. We are talking about a statutory fine limit.

Criminal Justice Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 24 May 2023

Pauline McNeill

As other members have said, it was an excellent visit. John Docherty, who has hosted us twice now, answered thousands of questions, so I found it really informative.

For completeness—I mentioned this earlier—we were clearly told that there were 100 places, and I wanted to note for the record that the note that we have says that it is

“a new national prison for 80 women”,

so there is a disparity of 20 somewhere along the line.