The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.
All Official Reports of meetings in the Debating Chamber of the Scottish Parliament.
All Official Reports of public meetings of committees.
Displaying 1943 contributions
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Thanks, Rohini. That is very strong. You talked about the “hard-to-reach” communities. Last week, we heard them reframed as the “seldom heard” as well. I like the framing of “easy to ignore” because that puts the responsibility on us, on public sector bodies and on public agencies. In terms of going out and listening, how do we ensure that we do not just spend more time talking? I am interested in your view on that.
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
You talked about the failure overall to address inequalities for disabled people. The PSED is only one lever in the range of available measures. I am wary of stepping on colleagues’ toes—I know that others want to come in on these issues, too—but is the understanding of what equalities actually means underpinning some of the failure? If so, what needs to change? Given the lack of action for years, is there something particular going on for disabled people?
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
You mentioned the idea of using the tools earlier on—in other words, starting from the equality impact assessment approach and looking at existing structural inequalities and so on. Do you think that that would help us to get into the nuts and bolts of what you described as the “bread and butter” of everyday life—housing, education and healthcare—rather than specific issues that relate to specific protected characteristic groups?
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
I see that Pauline Nolan wants to come back in.
11:30Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Rohini, what are your views on Age Scotland’s understanding of, or work with, the third need of fostering good relations?
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Thanks. Marie McNair wants to ask a little bit more about the reforms, so I will leave her to pick that up, because we need to explore it. I will leave it there.
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
I ask the same question of Clare Gallagher.
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Okay. Thanks. Lindsey Millen, I ask you the same question on fostering good relations.
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Good morning to the witnesses. Thank you for joining us this morning and for your comments so far.
You have all identified a gap between process and outcomes, and a failure to understand the connections. Given that one of the reasons for this inquiry is the lack of other levers to consider changing outcomes and making human rights and equalities real for people, where are the failures in that implementation gap? We have talked a bit about understanding, but we also heard questions about lack of accountability and leadership. Why does the public sector equality duty as we have it now not work? Rohini Sharma Joshi, I will start with you.
Equalities, Human Rights and Civil Justice Committee
Meeting date: 11 March 2025
Maggie Chapman
Thanks very much, Clare.
Jatin, you said that
“the point of having the public sector equality duty was to change people’s lives, but that has been missing”.
That is a very stark statement that we, in this committee, should take seriously. Is your view similar to Clare’s—that the reason for that is the gap between process and outcome—or is something else going on, as well?