Seòmar agus comataidhean

That is an important question, and I sympathise completely with it.

Again, it comes back to the fact that we are seeking change quickly. Organisations of a certain size are able to absorb that and keep up to date with it, whereas others of a different size are not as well placed to focus on the issues outside their own bottom line and keeping in business. Liam Middleton mentioned a lot of the pressures that are bearing down on the cost of doing business just now, and we absolutely recognise that.

There is a need for us to be clear, however, that the big emitters in the cluster are the ones that require our focus, first and foremost. They are the big industry businesses and the big emitters, and we should not underestimate their task of having to drive down emissions in the way that is required of them. That is not to say, however, that SMEs will not play an important part in the process, because they will do.

You touched on that when you said that the supply chain is a key element. There are two touch points that are important for SMEs in the plan. First, as we decarbonise the big industry, the supply chains that are connected with those industries will be vital to small and medium-sized enterprises, and we must engage with them on that.

The other point is that smaller businesses that are proximate to the cluster are stakeholders in the development of the vision, and they should also be part of the planning.

He is a really key part of GFIB, which is why we were hoping that he could come.

And it is a new forum, so it is probably not surprising that you are wondering what it is and how it works. It is quite a novel approach.

Again, I agree with much of what you have said, Mr MacDonald. The UK Government’s comments that you have just read out make it clear that Acorn and Scotland are uniquely well placed to lead the way on CCUS on skills, capacity and existing infrastructure. That is why the decision on track 1 was inexplicable; I am using that word deliberately, because I do not understand—and I am not alone in not understanding—why that did not come to pass.

However, we must welcome progress as and when it arises, so the UK Government’s indication that Acorn can be part of track 2 is good. I and my colleague Neil Gray are both seeking clarity on exactly when that process will close. We want it to close in short order so that we in Scotland can get on with what we ought to have been doing before now.

That is a really good question. I do not have the figure to hand, but I would be more than happy to go away, look at the EY analysis and perhaps come back to the committee on the matter. I wonder, though, whether Liam Middleton wants to add anything to that.

Absolutely. There are many lessons to be drawn from that. The focus on Grangemouth is absolutely right, because its contribution to our economy and to everyday life in Scotland sits so closely beside its emissions reduction and what it is doing there. If I have a vision for what we are seeking to do, it is about the trio of the economy, jobs and emissions. My vision is that we retain and grow economic value and jobs, and drive down emissions.

On learning from previous experiences, you talked about the community and workers; early and meaningful engagement with communities, workers and their trade unions has been so important. Liam Middleton might want to say more about that, but there has already been engagement. To date, we have worked with Unite the Union and I met union reps when I visited Grangemouth. Obviously, we are looking for ways of working with the Scottish Trades Union Congress just transition officers that we are funding. Another important initiative for this specific area is that we have decided to fund a Grangemouth community engagement officer to be a liaison between the Grangemouth community, what is happening in the cluster and what we are doing with the plan to make sure that the voices of people who live in the area, many of whom are employed at the site, are heard really loudly.

Liam, I do not know whether you have anything to add to that, particularly relating to the experience at Longannet.

That is a really good question. I go back to the point that, when we are trying to act with the pace and at the scale that the emergency demands from us, we must ensure that, in our efforts to respond, we do not forget about the really basic and important fundamentals of close and meaningful engagement. That means not just listening, but actually being able to demonstrate that what we heard was acted upon. Having come into this post, and with the Grangemouth just transition plan in front of us, I am absolutely determined that community involvement and engagement and a clear line of sight so that the community can see that its views have been reflected in the plan should be very much part of the plan.

I make no apology for returning to the point about us deciding to fund the employment of the community liaison person. That is someone from the area coming into the work to give an invaluable insight into what it means to live in the area, how people relate to the industrial complex, and what they want to see that do for them in future. That relates not only to the complex and its decarbonisation; it relates to what it feels like to live in the area or to travel around it. For example, there is an on-going issue with flooding in Grangemouth, which I know is a concern for many people.

I want to have as early and as broad a consultation as we possibly can, and it is my intention that we will be able to demonstrate exactly how views have been borne in mind and built into the plan.

Yes—absolutely. I do not blame any community for having consultation fatigue, but that does not mean that we should not do it. We have to do it. As you say, we have to be able to demonstrate fairly early on tangible ways in which views have been listened to and reflected upon.

I go back to my initial point about phasing. It is not going to take long. We are talking about publishing a plan in spring next year. By the middle of this year, we will be able to set out the economic baseline work that we have done, and we will have set out the vision for 2045, taking into account what we have heard from the consultations that we have undertaken. By the time we get to spring next year, there will be a tangible plan for the community, for workers and for industry, and for us and the public sector bodies that are involved in the future industry board to reflect on.

I will hand over to Andy McCall on the point about when and what we will publish.

It is right to say that the experience of the community can be independent of what happens at the cluster or deeply connected to it. Both have to be borne in mind.

We are at the beginning of the process, and I have talked about the desire for, and my intention that there will be, close engagement with the community. I expect that the issues relating to transport in and around the area and to the quality of housing and living experience in and around Grangemouth—how it is now and what it might be like as we move to the decarbonised cluster of the future—will come to the fore. Our community engagement officer will be able to feed in those views as they arise in the community. I do not want to pre-empt things by saying that those are the subjects that will come up, but I think that we are right that they will.

On transport, I know that there was an appraisal for a new station at Grangemouth as part of the second strategic transport projects review, but it was not recommended because of the current movements of people in and around the area, with people coming into the area from Edinburgh, Glasgow, Stirling and elsewhere. However, that is not the only transport issue. We need to think about how well communities are served by bus and by other means, and I expect that all that will form part of the feedback that we get from the community and will inform our thinking as we develop the plan.