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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Session 6: 13 May 2021 to 8 April 2026
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Displaying 4099 contributions

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Criminal Justice Committee

Police, Crime, Sentencing and Courts Bill

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

That concludes the public part of our meeting. Our next meeting will be on Wednesday 27 October, when we will hold a round-table evidence session on the role of the Scottish criminal justice sector in tackling the misuse of drugs.

12:41 Meeting continued in private until 13:06.  

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

I wonder whether post-Covid recovery provides an opportunity and could be used as a platform for reform. That brings me on to issues around changing demand. There has to be a balance between how we promote reform and the change in demand on the police service. In the report “Five year financial planning”, you talk about changing demand arising from the changing nature of crime, community expectations and needs and so on. We recently visited the Scottish crime campus and had quite a helpful discussion about the challenges of recruiting specialist staff to tackle, for example, cybercrime. Bearing that in mind, what might be the budgetary implications around changing demand and the specialist nature of some of that new demand? How might that impact on budgetary considerations?

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

Before we move on, I have a quick question on the subject of estates. I am aware that an estate condition survey was being undertaken, and I think that that was due to be published or reported back on some time ago. Do you have an update on that?

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

Ms McNeill, do you want to come in on this subject?

Criminal Justice Committee

Decision on Taking Business in Private

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

Good morning, everybody, and welcome to the seventh meeting in 2021 of the Criminal Justice Committee. Apologies have been received from Katy Clark.

The first agenda item is to decide whether to take in private items 4 and 5, which are to consider today’s evidence and to discuss our work programme. Do we agree to take those items in private?

Members indicated agreement.

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

That perhaps covers my follow-up question, which was about how specialist criminal law firms might need to change their model of practice and what budget considerations might need to be taken into account to allow that to happen. Do you want to add anything on that?

12:00  

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

That is a helpful response.

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

Yes, but I ask that you respectfully confine your questioning to budget provision and considerations.

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

Do you want to ask a follow-up question, Mr MacGregor?

Criminal Justice Committee

Pre-Budget Scrutiny 2022-23

Meeting date: 6 October 2021

Audrey Nicoll

The next agenda item is the first in a short series of evidence-taking sessions on spending priorities in the justice sector for 2022-23. I refer members to committee papers 1 to 3.

I welcome our witnesses, whom I am delighted to see in person for a change. We have, from Police Scotland, David Page, deputy chief officer, and James Gray, chief financial officer; and, from the Scottish Police Authority, Chris Brown, acting chief executive and accountable officer. We very much appreciate your taking the time to join us this morning.

I thank the witnesses for their written submissions, which are available online. I intend to allow an hour and 15 minutes for questions and discussion.

Before we move to questions, on behalf of the committee, I put on record our best wishes to Lynn Brown, the chief executive of the Scottish Police Authority. We all wish her a speedy recovery.

I ask that members indicate to which witness they are directing their remarks. We can then open the floor to other witnesses for comments. If other witnesses wish to respond to a question, please indicate to me or the clerks that you want to come in and I will bring you in, if time permits. If you agree with what a witness is saying, there is no need to intervene to say so.

We will move directly to questions. I ask that members and our invited guests please keep their questions and comments as succinct as possible.

I plan to structure the discussion around a series of broad themes. I will start by looking at the budget requirements as we come out of the pandemic and, in particular, at what is needed to return to pre-Covid levels of working.

Police Scotland’s written submission makes specific reference to the implications for the service arising from the anticipated increase in court delivery, including in relation to witness scheduling and broader summary justice reform. In the context of budget scrutiny, I am quite interested to hear you outline that in more detail. What opportunities might there be to offset some of those costs? I am thinking in particular about the implications of the commitments on police officer time to attend court. I address that question to Mr Page and Mr Gray.