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Official Report: search what was said in Parliament

The Official Report is a written record of public meetings of the Parliament and committees.  

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Dates of parliamentary sessions
  1. Session 1: 12 May 1999 to 31 March 2003
  2. Session 2: 7 May 2003 to 2 April 2007
  3. Session 3: 9 May 2007 to 22 March 2011
  4. Session 4: 11 May 2011 to 23 March 2016
  5. Session 5: 12 May 2016 to 4 May 2021
  6. Session 6: 13 May 2021 to 8 April 2026
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Displaying 1640 contributions

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Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

Those projections are a result of on-going discussions between officials and local authorities or stakeholders. We have tried to gather as much data as possible to inform the Government’s view of the bill, because that is a very important consideration. I believe that it came up during an evidence session that the committee has written to local authorities on data requirements, and I will be very interested to see what comes back to the committee on that. Saskia Kearns has also alluded to the further work that can be done to gather data.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

At the moment, the figures that I have show that 12,741 individuals are barred from regulated work with children and/or protected adults.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

I think that it could. Again, I will refer to some of the visits that I have been on, whether to nursery settings that are utilising outdoor learning, to fully outdoor nurseries or to schools that are utilising outdoor learning, because that is the best evidence to draw on.

On those visits, I heard about impacts that were much the same as those that are associated with five-day residentials. I heard about the children’s increased confidence, improvements in the mental health and wellbeing of children and staff and improvements in the relationships between children and staff. I base my view on the many discussions that I have had on outdoor learning. I absolutely agree that the kind of experiences that you mention can bring similar benefits.

10:00  

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

As I said earlier, I am positive about that residential experience. I can see the benefits of it. When I spoke with the people who were involved in those settings, they said that the trips improved their relationships. I am absolutely not talking that down in any way. However, as you suggested in your first question, the proposal has serious financial implications, and, when you see similar benefits being received by children and young people in more cost-effective ways, the committee and the Government have to consider that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

The evidence has painted a relatively mixed picture. I heard a lot of the same concerns that the Government has about affordability and capacity. However, equally, I heard a lot of commentary on the positives of outdoor learning, specifically in relation to outdoor residential visits. I am a big supporter of outdoor learning in all its forms, and support for that has come across strongly.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

I will bring in officials to speak to that.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

Yes. That is a simple answer.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

I think that it would put a very narrow scope on outdoor learning, as it might lead schools or local authorities to feel that this is the sort of outdoor learning that children and young people have to receive. However, we want outdoor learning to be a day-to-day thing that children and young people experience in the classroom as well as in different environments. I have concerns that the bill’s narrow scope on outdoor learning centres pigeonholes everything into one form of outdoor learning, whereas we must ensure that we give children and young people a vast array of outdoor learning experiences on a day-to-day basis.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Schools (Residential Outdoor Education) (Scotland) Bill

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

I will ask officials to speak to the evidence on that. We have already talked about capacity and staffing, but I worry about confining things to just one week. Again, there could be flexibility in that, and I have discussed the matter at length with the member, but I will ask my officials whether there is evidence that proves that the bill would take away from other outdoor learning experiences.

Education, Children and Young People Committee

Subordinate Legislation

Meeting date: 27 November 2024

Natalie Don-Innes

Absolutely. The Government considers the term “details” in the context of paragraph 6 of the schedule to the regulations to be sufficiently clear as meaning the details about the person for whom the individual is carrying out a regulated role, as that would enable Disclosure Scotland to establish whether a regulated role is or was being carried out and to have the contact details to make further inquiries.

The regulations would only require the chief constable to provide information that is held by them. It would also apply only to referrals made by the chief constable.

The Scottish ministers are required, under section 84A of the Protection of Vulnerable Groups (Scotland) Act 2007, to issue guidance to the chief constable about the exercise of our functions under parts 1 and 2 of the act. This guidance will include guidance on the operation of referrals under part 1 of the act.

Essentially, the Scottish Government considers the term “details” to be sufficiently clear.